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September 25, 2010

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Kay Tie

"claims to not be a Tory is picking on someone who castigated a Tory AM for welcoming back into the Tories a man of no political spine"

I haven't the foggiest idea what you're talking about. I don't know the names, have no idea about the politics any more than I have any idea about Scottish bickering. It's all so provincial. I'm happy for you that you seem to know what she's talking about, and I'd be even happier if you went your merry way as an independent country and this became the centre of your political strife.

HuwOS

HAha

KayTie who spends so much time prattling about tribalism and who claims to not be a Tory
is picking on someone who castigated a Tory AM for welcoming back into the Tories a man of no political spine,views or vision at all who traipsed around nearly every party until he finally got a seat on a party vote rather than a personal vote before "realising" that he didn't share any views with the party he had stood for.

Serenading was certainly not the best word that Margaret could have used, but the meaning was clear and we can certainly imagine a certain amount of praise singing happened whether at night or not is another question.

But then KayTie, when you have nothing to say, but want another chance to express your bitterness you do prefer to attack anything at all rather than to hold your tongue.

Kay Tie

"serenading him around"

I don't understand. Who did the singing at night?

Maybe you meant "parading"?

Or maybe this a Google translate problem and you really meant to say "Yr wyf i ffwrdd o'r swyddfa ar hyn o bryd. Byddaf yn ymateb i'ch neges pan fyddaf yn dychwelyd."

Margaret

There must be a chance of taking Monmouth whilst the current ineffectual AM is in position. His biggest coup was convincing serial defector Mohammad Asghar to join the Tories and then serenading him around understandably unimpressed local Tory Members. Pretty hopeless return when he has such a big electoral margin to fall back on. I really don't see why this shouldn't be a target at the Assembly - we've a strong association. Although in fairness, the MP is a different matter who seems to attract support from areas the Tories would normally perform poorly in.

Kay Tie

"You feel insecure because you are wealthy. Well you should, but that is not our fault. It is your own."

It's not my fault that Red Ed stood up and talked about income tax at 50%. I am not going to be coerced into spending more than half my effort working for him and the other parasites he represents.

HuwOS

Actually Ad, she claims not to be wealthy.
So it is pure fantasy that if she were wealthy she would lose out if "socialism" were actually being practised.

It's fear at two removes, classic US tea partier fear.


Ad


'Not at all. Winds having changed is very different from a complete way of life that is sustained by wealth transfers from the vibrant part of the economy. You can't take money from wealth creators then spit in their faces for daring to create wealth, for engaging in "theft", for making profits.'

As I said its a cold viewpoint. They 'spit in your face' by voting for Labour who you voted for in 1997.

Its more a problem for you that you have wealth. Your scared now. You complain about how much of your money you get to keep (whilst still being wealthy). Why are you telling us?

You've no respect for anyone who isn't wealthy like you. Whole regions and countries are 'parasites'. You are a self-righteous obnoxious person.

You bore us all to death with the whinging. YOU are the parasite, the unneeded self-interested bore. You waste eveeryones time whinging that because you are wealthy, the ‘nasty people’ want to take it.

Its boring deluded nonsense.

You feel insecure because you are wealthy. Well you should, but that is not our fault. It is your own.

Kay Tie

"that's all anyone gets from people like you"

If only it were, my friend. Unfortunately, your lot get a heck of a lot more than that. Hard cash. More of it than I get to keep.

I'd rather have a tapeworm than a socialist eating my lunch: at least all I'd get with a tapeworm is an itchy arse.

Kay Tie

"The cold hearted view you take is that the previous generations may have been the backbone of industry but now the winds have changed you call them parasites."

Not at all. Winds having changed is very different from a complete way of life that is sustained by wealth transfers from the vibrant part of the economy. You can't take money from wealth creators then spit in their faces for daring to create wealth, for engaging in "theft", for making profits.

"The only system and politics you foillow is hoarding money."

Not at all. It's invested, not hoarded. And I created several jobs this month. None of them in Wales or Scotland, of course: I'd rather not be spat at, metaphorically or actually.

" I mean thanks for all the coal which fueled the industrial revolution."

I seem to recall that it was all built on capital from the Earl of Bute. So you should be thanking that particular Scot. I also seem to recall that Wales did very well out of the industrial revolution.

Ad

'I think we are perfectly within our rights to whinge at the Labour-voting Welsh and Scottish parasites. About time you stood on your own feet and stopped sucking at the English teat, boyo.'

The cold hearted view you take is that the previous generations may have been the backbone of industry but now the winds have changed you call them parasites. The only system and politics you foillow is hoarding money. An extremely foolish ideal not least for its hubris.

As far as the Welsh, one wonders why England ever bothered conquering and ruling it doesn't one? I mean thanks for all the coal which fueled the industrial revolution. But the winds have changed, now they be parasites, not brethren.

HuwOS

"I think we are perfectly within our rights to whinge"

We know you do, that's all anyone gets from people like you, whinging, whining and griping about how everyone and everything is just soooo unfair.

Kay Tie

"KayTie, yet another embodiment of the classic and nearly world famous "English whinge"."

I think we are perfectly within our rights to whinge at the Labour-voting Welsh and Scottish parasites. About time you stood on your own feet and stopped sucking at the English teat, boyo.

HuwOS

"My parents are English and live in England. There is no luck to being born English in England."

So not luck just judgement eh?

Bad luck for many though to have such a bitter little dose added to the population of England, but at least you blend in well with the UKIPs and the BNPs or any of the other shining representatives of the right, whether old Tory or "New" labour, all determined that somehow they are being hard done by, whether it's by Europe or by foreigners or just by the nasty underclasses who won't rest easy until they take everything from them. In each situation the enemy is different but the whining, self justification and sense of entitlement remains the same.

KayTie, yet another embodiment of the classic and nearly world famous "English whinge".


Kay Tie

"Well, yes unless you believe in predestination, it was."

Only if you believe in a pool of souls allocated to new foetuses is there any such luck. My parents are English and live in England. There is no luck to being born English in England.

HuwOS

"It wasn't chance I grew up in England, was it?"

Well, yes unless you believe in predestination, it was.

" I've merely worked for what I have."
Many people with nothing have worked very hard, many people with lots have never worked at all. We have no idea what you have or if you have contributed anything of worth to justify what you have.
Your constant championing of those whose fortunes are built on the labours of others suggest you probably are not.

"And been lucky."
Apparently true, although for all we know you may be a fantasist whose reality is living in deepest poverty.

"And been intelligent."
Glad you used past tense, as there is little sign of intelligence from you here over the last year.
Then again, we have no evidence that you ever had any.

"And made the right choices."
Again apparently assuming you aren't a complete fantasist(an assumption that flies in the face of the evidence we have to hand), although even if true luck plays a great part in that too.
Perhaps you won the lottery, if you did it was the right choice to play, although it is a poor choice for anyone.
Perhaps you got a job in a company that expanded rather than going to the wall through luck rather than judgement.
We have no idea what you do, you've made a lot of potentially contradictory claims over your time here.
From your manner, you may work closely with someone who does do things and think that because you work for them that you are part of the decision making team.
Probably a glorified PA or secretary.
That's not a guess, I have no idea what you do, it's just how you come across.

"All things that Huw and his Trots want to punish me for"
And now I'm apparently the head of the Trotskyites, I must have missed a memo.
Is that just in Wales Kaytie, UK wide or globally?
The only things I would actually like you to suffer the consequences of are your constant fabrications and lies. Even then I doubt you are actually competent enough to be held fully responsible.


Kay Tie

"Right place right time and random chance can play just as much a part as any other factor in the very wealthy becoming very wealthy. You grew up in England and not Baghdad for a start."

It wasn't chance I grew up in England, was it?

And although luck plays a part in success, it's not the major factor. In any case, I'm not very wealthy. I've merely worked for what I have. And been lucky. And been intelligent. And made the right choices. All things that Huw and his Trots want to punish me for.

And what they really hate more than anything else is my aspiration. They want to even this out by handicapping those who dare to aspire to get on.

"You called whole regions of the country parasites earlier. Are they not hard working?"

Not as much as England. A huge swathe of Scotland would rather vote Labour and force England to give it money, by creating high-paying public sector jobs or handing out other forms of welfare.

"Not everybody can be succesful entrepreneurs. "

Everyone can do what inspires them and they have talent for. That might not be starting a business. But Huw and his Trots want to punish anyone who wants to choose for themselves how they will get on in life.

"Who would provide the ranks of unemployed to keep wages down?"

No-one. Why should society be engineered to control wages? It's a despicable thing to do.

"Is it just unions you don’t like?"

Trade unions that are advocates for the workforce to act collectively, fine. Trade unions that are extortionists (either of employers or their members) are wicked. They are no different to the people who used to control guilds in the olden days. Self-interested exploiters designed to restrict freedom.

The "Amicus" union barons are the worst sort.

Ad

'On the contrary, I earn every penny of my wealth. I've saved and invested and am by natural law entitled to the proceeds of my effort.'

Right place right time and random chance can play just as much a part as any other factor in the very wealthy becoming very wealthy. You grew up in England and not Baghdad for a start.

'You bitter people are jealous parasites who prey on the hard working, consuming the effort of others.'

You called whole regions of the country parasites earlier. Are they not hard working? Not everybody can be succesful entrepreneurs. Who would clean the streets? Who would provide the ranks of unemployed to keep wages down?

‘Whenever your kind have power you exploit it to enrich yourselves. Just look at the union barons expressing solidarity with their members, taking six figure salaries.’

As if the union leaders all claim to be communist revolutionaries! Is it just unions you don’t like? Or is it the imaginary professions of Leninism which rile you?

Kay Tie

"doesn't simply nationalise it"

Railtrack was nationalized.

You do realise that nationalizing something requires paying for it? Only the most bitter of bitter old Trots advocates outright theft of assets (which is illegal under the ECHR).

"an overwhelming sense of entitlement."

On the contrary, I earn every penny of my wealth. I've saved and invested and am by natural law entitled to the proceeds of my effort. It is you who think that you are entitled to something you didn't work for. You bitter people are jealous parasites who prey on the hard working, consuming the effort of others. Whenever your kind have power you exploit it to enrich yourselves. Just look at the union barons expressing solidarity with their members, taking six figure salaries.

HuwOS

PS

I love the way you castigate the £10 million a year to unions and defend the failed company that begged the government for support got an extra £1.5bn from them and paid out a quarter of that to their shareholders, hundreds of millions of pounds in one go.
Then despite the government guaranteeing them around £13bn over 4 years, insisted they needed another £4bn on top and could not function without it.
Then when the government has to take it all back, but being of the right doesn't simply nationalise it and it's billions in debt these shareholders have a sense of entitlement that demands compensation and when it gets it, wants more.

This is all you represent KayTie, greed and an overwhelming sense of entitlement.

HuwOS

I've often said that KayTie tends to accuse others of her own worst traits

"No loyalty, jealous, and out to disrupt whereever possible."

Pretty much confirms my hypothesis.

Kay Tie

"you meant, to have to pick up the slack when private enterprise failed miserably."

No, after Stephen Byers tried to steal Railtrack from "grannies" and in the end the Government had to pay market value.

"that the state will have to pick it up when we screw it up"

In the vast majority of cases, the state doesn't pick up anything. And in a large number of cases, the state forces companies into bankruptcy.

You've never run a business, have you? I hope to God no-one in a private business has ever hired you either: you'd be the worst employee ever. No loyalty, jealous, and out to disrupt whereever possible.

Paul Flynn

No Patrick Mark had nothing to do with that. He has sound views on animal welfare issues.

HuwOS

By "to nationalise railway infrastructure"
you meant, to have to pick up the slack when private enterprise failed miserably.

Which of course is the ultimate dream of the free market capitalists, "we do everything with the full knowledge that when what we're doing is essential, that the state will have to pick it up when we screw it up and we still keep any money we siphoned off and retain our freedom because as capitalists we accept no responsibility for anything at all"

Kay Tie

"You know, everything that was wrong and has been proven to be disastrous with New Labour in particular and the right wing in general."

Of course, it's right wing to give £10m a year of taxpayers money to trade unions, to nationalise railway infrastructure, and to be so obsessed with equality you will cheerfully instruct the NHS to let someone die if they have the temerity to use their own savings to preserve their life just a bit longer.

Silly me. I forgot. All despicable acts, therefore in your world view, right wing acts.

HuwOS

To the right of Thatcher, KayTie, is maintaining the moves she made and expanding on them, as with the quangos, university top up fees, PFI, light touch regulation on the financial markets etc etc.

You know, everything that was wrong and has been proven to be disastrous with New Labour in particular and the right wing in general.

Someday KayTie, you will find out what left wing actually means and then if you have contributed to future generations at all, you will be glad to welcome it with open arms as this country will be a better place for it.

Until then enjoy your US teaparty style of calling right wing parties and politicians that you don't like - socialists and communists to your heart's content.
If you need more, we'll get you a rattle or some shiny keys to focus on.

treborc

God from Labour elections to badgers, Christ sake.

Will the Milibands pull Labour together, I doubt it, will Labour go to wards a new labour or new Labour I suspect so, will i return to the party nope why bother.

Will labour win the next election, depends on the Tories if they can get things into shape then no, if they fail I'll still say nope

Patrick

"Mark is a prominent Newport Councillor, a seasoned campaigner and a legal expert on Assembly law making."

Does that include the Welsh Assemblies Victorian and barbaric laws about culling our Wildlife?

Kay Tie

What interesting use of language: anyone who learns the lesson that old fashioned socialism failed and the need to be smarter is "to the right of Thatcher".

HuwOS

Ah what interesting use KayTie puts language to
being to the right of Thatcher is in KayTie's eyes "crypto-socialist"

Kay Tie

Huw, I'd be delighted if Labour moved radically to the left. Rather than crypto-socialist, we'd see the true colours in the open. And then Labour would cease to exist except as a lobby group for the parasitical regions.

Kay Tie

"170.000 popular votes to 140,000"

How many people voted more than once? Quite a few pseudo-votes from union members doubled up there, I think.

But then Labour has never been very comfortable with democracy, has it? If it was, why rig it so that Scotland has disproportionate power over England? Why gerrymander boundaries to give Labour more MPs with 8m votes than the Tories got for 10m votes?

Paul Flynn

It's an impressive victory. 170.000 popular votes to 140,000. Ed Milliband has proved himself as a vote winner. it was not just we political nerds who supported David, it was those on the fringes on politics who voted for Ed. It was a triumph for him.

HuwOS

Well the other Milliband won.
About the only thing that can be said about that so far is that at least the Labour party is not just voting on looks.

Maybe if Ed radically shifted the party to the left it could settle down as a slightly right of centre party and KayTie could still call it Stalinist, socialist etc.
There'd need to be medics stood by KayTie if it actually went back to being a left wing party, gaskets would blow and the risk to bystanders would be high.

Kay Tie

New New Labour? Or Trade Union Labour? Public Sector Workers Party?

What are you going to call yourselves?

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